Deleting plugins...permanently

Is anyone else annoyed by constantly having to delete plugins with every eap? I know I'll never need the tomcat, weblogic, starteam, or sourcesafe plugins, so the first thing I do with every eap is wipe these out. Much to my dismay though, idea promptly forgets my expression of pluginhatred, and the next eap brings them back, and I have to go through the whole painful process again.

So, there are two solutions:
1) Make IDEA remember which plugins were deleted, and have all the default ones also be available in pluginmanager (so I can bring them back if by some miracle I change my mind)
2) Make deleting a bunch of plugins easier. I'd like to select a bunch of them with the keyboard and hit delete and see one confirmation dialog. Right now it's select, click on red icon, confirm, select, click, confirm, etc.

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What good does it do to delete a plugin?

Hani Suleiman wrote:

Is anyone else annoyed by constantly having to delete plugins with
every eap? I know I'll never need the tomcat, weblogic, starteam, or
sourcesafe plugins, so the first thing I do with every eap is wipe
these out. Much to my dismay though, idea promptly forgets my
expression of pluginhatred, and the next eap brings them back, and I
have to go through the whole painful process again.

So, there are two solutions: 1) Make IDEA remember which plugins were
deleted, and have all the default ones also be available in
pluginmanager (so I can bring them back if by some miracle I change
my mind) 2) Make deleting a bunch of plugins easier. I'd like to
select a bunch of them with the keyboard and hit delete and see one
confirmation dialog. Right now it's select, click on red icon,
confirm, select, click, confirm, etc.

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Because I might have absolutely no use for it? Too much clutter (especially ones that add tabs to the run/debug dialog)? Overhead?

Let's turn the question around. If there's no point in ever deleting a plugin, why not just install every single plugin?

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Hani Suleiman wrote:

Because I might have absolutely no use for it? Too much clutter
(especially ones that add tabs to the run/debug dialog)? Overhead?

Let's turn the question around. If there's no point in ever deleting
a plugin, why not just install every single plugin?


I don't think StarTeam or WebLogic integration or ZKM Unscramble have
ever gotten in my way and I predict that they never will. I guess
there's less than 1% improvement in startup time and memory use gained
from deleting these plugins.

We can take your proposal to the extreme too. I don't use macros or
Commander or dependency analysis, but I'm not going to use a hex editor
on the .class files to remove all the instructions that are being wasted.

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Hello Hani,

HS> 2) Make deleting a bunch of plugins easier. I'd like to select a
HS> bunch of them with the keyboard and hit delete and see one
HS> confirmation dialog. Right now it's select, click on red icon,
HS> confirm, select, click, confirm, etc.

Why don't you just delete them in the file system, after install? It's quicker
this way, since you'd have to restart IDEA anyway. And for an even quicker
option, create a shell script that deletes the ones you don't like.

That's not to say the multiple selection delete is not a good idea. I have
long hoped for an option to upgrade/delete a subset of the installed plugins,
just haven't decided if it's worth jetbrains' time, yet (especially since
more important - in my opinion - usability issues have been backlogged).

Best,
Andrei


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I think if there is a plug-in manager out there Jetbrains should use it for
their plug-ins as well. Why install plug-ins by default that people may
or may not use? I mean the whole concept of the plug-in manager is so that
people can pick and choose what they want to add to the IDE. Why force certain
ones to be installed?

Hello Keith,

Hani Suleiman wrote:

>> Because I might have absolutely no use for it? Too much clutter
>> (especially ones that add tabs to the run/debug dialog)? Overhead?
>>
>> Let's turn the question around. If there's no point in ever deleting
>> a plugin, why not just install every single plugin?
>>

I don't think StarTeam or WebLogic integration or ZKM Unscramble have
ever gotten in my way and I predict that they never will. I guess
there's less than 1% improvement in startup time and memory use gained
from deleting these plugins.

We can take your proposal to the extreme too. I don't use macros or
Commander or dependency analysis, but I'm not going to use a hex
editor on the .class files to remove all the instructions that are
being wasted.



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I've seen many people say that something they like about IDEA is that it
comes bundled with things thhat you have to hunt for plugins for, for
other IDE's. I don't think people would like it if IDEA came without CVS
support, for example.

no_mail@jetbrains.com wrote:

I think if there is a plug-in manager out there Jetbrains should use it
for their plug-ins as well. Why install plug-ins by default that people
may or may not use? I mean the whole concept of the plug-in manager is
so that people can pick and choose what they want to add to the IDE.
Why force certain ones to be installed?

Hello Keith,

>> Hani Suleiman wrote:
>>
>>> Because I might have absolutely no use for it? Too much clutter
>>> (especially ones that add tabs to the run/debug dialog)? Overhead?
>>>
>>> Let's turn the question around. If there's no point in ever deleting
>>> a plugin, why not just install every single plugin?
>>>
>> I don't think StarTeam or WebLogic integration or ZKM Unscramble have
>> ever gotten in my way and I predict that they never will. I guess
>> there's less than 1% improvement in startup time and memory use gained
>> from deleting these plugins.
>>
>> We can take your proposal to the extreme too. I don't use macros or
>> Commander or dependency analysis, but I'm not going to use a hex
>> editor on the .class files to remove all the instructions that are
>> being wasted.
>>


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This is the EAP, so each new delivery/installation requires some
hand-tuning. That's OK as it only takes a minute or two.

A feature I'd like to see implemented is a "disable plugin" action, that
would keep IDEA from loading a plugin. This would soothen your pain too.

Alain

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I've seen many people say that something they like about IDEA is that it
comes bundled with things thhat you have to hunt for plugins for, for
other IDE's.

I can confirm that. Almost all our Eclipse users complain about this
problem. In fact, in the begining they say nothing - only when it comes
to IDE updates and they need to find the corect plug-in version
combination again by themselfs it starts to be a nightmare.

Ahmed.

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Hani Suleiman wrote:

Is anyone else annoyed by constantly having to delete plugins with
every eap?


This is just one of the many usability issues with the plugin manager. I
delete 7 plugins each new build. Doing this via the plugin manager would
be an exercise in frustration. I just delete them manually from the
plugins directory. I'm not happy about it, but it is a lot better than
using the plugin manager.

1) Make IDEA remember which plugins were deleted, and have all the
default ones also be available in pluginmanager (so I can bring them
back if by some miracle I change my mind)


This would just be useful for EAP users. Most users don't install a new
build often and would hardly benefit from this.

2) Make deleting a bunch of plugins easier. I'd like to select a
bunch of them with the keyboard and hit delete and see one
confirmation dialog. Right now it's select, click on red icon,
confirm, select, click, confirm, etc.


This seems an easy way to decrease frustration and benefits all plugin
manager users. Where is the JIRA request?

Bas

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Oh I definitely don't think that the plugins should not be shipped. I'd be equally (or even more) furious if I were forced to download a plugin for such basic things as cvs support or intentions.

My only point is that the usability of the plugin manager is pretty bad right now, and could be quite easily improved.

Also, why is it that the bundled plugins aren't available in the plugin manager? Isn't there any benefit in upgrading one of the core plugins without upgrading idea?

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In article <dbhtbc$43s$1@is.intellij.net>,
Keith Lea <keith@cs.oswego.edu> wrote:

I've seen many people say that something they like about IDEA is that it
comes bundled with things thhat you have to hunt for plugins for, for
other IDE's. I don't think people would like it if IDEA came without CVS
support, for example.


That's not Hani's point. The point is that it comes with all of it, he
(and others including myself) don't want to use all of them, and want to
chuck them out the window the first time they use IDEA. The next time
there is an update, no one wants to go through the steps of resetting
things up and removing clutter, why not have some file which tells idea
that you removed those plugins and have idea toss them on startup, or at
least ask if you really want to toss them because you did before.

Look at it this way... How about you put a big ass television set on
your desk along with your computer and everything else you need for
work, the TV set doesn't do anything, it doesn't make your work any less
productive, but it's a distraction and sure takes up space where it
doesn't need to.

R

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After reading the entire thread my personal opinion is:

1. Not having multiple selection in any instance management grid is
sloppy UI and should be avoided. The plugin manager is no exception,
regardless of the frequency people do it. Imagine Windows Explorer if
you could only copy, cut, delete and open 1 file at a time...

2. Disabling one or more plugins is an important feature for many
reasons, such as what Hani wants to do (as this would be kept in the
settings between builds), and also for verifying a plugin is causing
problems, where disabling and enabling is much easier than deleting and
reinstalling.

3. Any extreme is usually bad. Having every little IntelliJ function as
a downloadable plugin would make IJ hard to deploy like other systems
where in order to get XML editing one needs to download 4 zip files and
some libraries and essentially manually install everything. I think that
JetBrains keep a pretty good balance between what's a plugin and what's
not, and just need to allow us to more easily tune our IJ according to
our needs now that there are all these integrations that not all of us use.

Personally I used to do what Hani and others here do until I got tired
of it and stopped doing it, but I agree with the claims of added clutter
and annoyance.

Regards,
Amnon

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Hello Hani,

HS> 1) Make IDEA remember which plugins were deleted, and have all the
HS> default ones also be available in pluginmanager (so I can bring them
HS> back if by some miracle I change my mind)
HS>
HS> 2) Make deleting a bunch of plugins easier. I'd like to select a
HS> bunch of them with the keyboard and hit delete and see one
HS> confirmation dialog. Right now it's select, click on red icon,
HS> confirm, select, click, confirm, etc.

Disabling and enabling for plugins must be helpfull in this case :)

--
Alexey Efimov, Java Developer
Tops BI


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