RC1 out now!

Wooohoo congrats Jetbrains ;)

Now to beat the manager up for license renewal ( its sad, we have 12
licenses of IDEA 3.x but we're now down to 4 developers, of which only 2
of us use IDEA. )

Wish we could take compound upgrade discounts and make 2 free upgrades :O

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Awsome! You can count on us here upgrading!

"Mark Derricutt" <mark@talios.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.01.23.21.31.16.622659@talios.com...

Wooohoo congrats Jetbrains ;)

>

Now to beat the manager up for license renewal ( its sad, we have 12
licenses of IDEA 3.x but we're now down to 4 developers, of which only 2
of us use IDEA. )

>

Wish we could take compound upgrade discounts and make 2 free upgrades :O

>


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On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 16:31:20 -0700, Amnon I. Govrin wrote:

Awsome! You can count on us here upgrading!


Definitely. I'm lucky our dev manager is the OTHER IDEA user. But
budget, oh the budget.... don't ask about the budget :P

Mark

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My manager thought I had accidently misplaced the decimal when I asked him to spring for my $149.00 IDEA 4.0 upgrade. My company just spent a gazillion $$$ on JBuilder licenses, but I said no thanks. I'll stick with my personal copy of IDEA. There's a sucker born every minute.

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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 00:45:01 +0000, jason boutwell wrote:

My manager thought I had accidently misplaced the decimal when I asked him
to spring for my $149.00 IDEA 4.0 upgrade. My company just spent a
gazillion $$$ on JBuilder licenses, but I said no thanks. I'll stick with
my personal copy of IDEA. There's a sucker born every minute.


Heh. Sadly my personal copy isn't a "personal license", so it'll cost me
a bit to upgrade personally. Heres hopeing work springs forth the $$$
intime for this not to expire :)

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A good IDE is like a good sofa or a monitor - you spend most of your
time on it so you might as well spend a good deal of money on it. IMHO,
if an organization can't find the money for a few licenses for an
excellent IDE then they don't respect their developers much.

Nick.

Mark Derricutt wrote:

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 16:31:20 -0700, Amnon I. Govrin wrote:

>>Awsome! You can count on us here upgrading!


Definitely. I'm lucky our dev manager is the OTHER IDEA user. But
budget, oh the budget.... don't ask about the budget :P

Mark

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we have 12
licenses of IDEA 3.x but we're now down to 4
developers, of which only 2
of us use IDEA.


Just curious about the 2 developers not using IDEA: they don't write in Java, or are they simply nuts? :)
(No other explanation springs to my mind :)

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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 03:33:45 +0000, vlad wrote:

Just curious about the 2 developers not using IDEA: they don't
write in Java, or are they simply nuts? :) (No other explanation springs
to my mind :)


One uses NetBeans ( the poor sole ), and the other Eclipse.

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We have a similar situation at my office. Three IDEA developers, one Eclipse and one using a combination of Emacs and IDEA.

I still never got a good explanation why the Eclipse guy uses it. My guess is that he just don't want to shell out for it, since he's a consultant who can choose (and pay for) his own tools.

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We switched from JBuilder to Eclipse as the general IDE. Two of us like to use Idea and it took us six months and the holiday seasons offer to get our Intellij license. The other 15+ developers use Eclipse, five of them are Eclipse gurus and the others simply don't know how to develop with pleasure ;)

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There's only one thing I would like from Eclipse in IDEA...and that's the very nice New Class dialog.

Patrick

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...but we can write plug-ins ;)

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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 10:34:52 +0000, Elias M wrote:

I still never got a good explanation why the Eclipse guy uses it. My guess
is that he just don't want to shell out for it, since he's a consultant
who can choose (and pay for) his own tools.


The (new) guy in our office using Eclipse tried IDEA for awhile, however,
he tried my EAP RPMs, and well, at that stage it was throwing exceptions
all over the place, so he switched to Eclipse which he had previously used...

Now he's just comfortable with it I guess.

Mark

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Yeah, I never usually show anyone an early IDEA EAP. Only when they really start to stabalize (like where I would use it all the time) do I start showing them around. 4.0 is starting to turn some heads at my office.

Patrick

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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 20:48:57 +0000, Patrick Burleson wrote:

Yeah, I never usually show anyone an early IDEA EAP. Only when they really
start to stabalize (like where I would use it all the time) do I start
showing them around. 4.0 is starting to turn some heads at my office.


I don't think I ever STOPPED using the EAP once I did. Mind you, there
were a few times, esp. when the new CVS started that I was cursing alot.
But then, I just started using SmartCVS or cvs command line :p

Mark

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In article <busite$mgh$1@is.intellij.net>,
Nick Atkins <natkins@slippytoad.com> wrote:

A good IDE is like a good sofa or a monitor - you spend most of your
time on it so you might as well spend a good deal of money on it. IMHO,
if an organization can't find the money for a few licenses for an
excellent IDE then they don't respect their developers much.


You do, though, have to spend money as efficiently as possible. It is
usually a limited resource, so you may be choosing between a profiler
and IDEA, or a UML tool and a copy of JBuilder. Personally, I find IDEA
far more efficient than JBuilder, but an IDE is a very subjective item.

Even one missing feature can do it. At one client, not having local
cvs, and having problems with cvs via SSH made IDEA a non starter. They
were quite wowed by Jaques Morel's JUnit plugin, and found it quite
competitive with the Eclipse "New JUnit test" feature.

At another one, the existence of a WebObjects plugin for Eclipse sold
them on Eclipse. They also liked the Eclipse new class dialog a bunch.

I did buy my copy with my own money, because $500 was above what the
consulting group was willing to pay.

Scott

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....of buying IntelliJ, but I purchased the MyEclipse $ 30 annual
subscription instead and saved myself a significant chunk of cash.
Speaking in general terms, MyEclipse is pretty good now and I fully
expect it to rather rapidly improve.

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On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:13:51 -0800, Mr. Poster wrote:

...of buying IntelliJ, but I purchased the MyEclipse $ 30 annual
subscription instead and saved myself a significant chunk of cash.
Speaking in general terms, MyEclipse is pretty good now and I fully expect
it to rather rapidly improve.


How does MyEclipse compare to standard eclipse?

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Mark Derricutt wrote:

On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:13:51 -0800, Mr. Poster wrote:

>>...of buying IntelliJ, but I purchased the MyEclipse $ 30 annual
>>subscription instead and saved myself a significant chunk of cash.
>>Speaking in general terms, MyEclipse is pretty good now and I fully expect
>>it to rather rapidly improve.


How does MyEclipse compare to standard eclipse?


Wo, check out the list of features for J2EE related stuff, especially
app servers.

R

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Sadly, it's time for me to part with Idea. For the last two years I've got by at home, knocking out code for my personal use using Idea EAP releases.

This week I finally made the switch at work from a VB to a Java based project. Unfortunately, they use Eclipse and, not surprisingly, can't see the logic of paying hundreds of pounds for one developer to use a different IDE to everyone else (who are happily using a functionally almost identical free IDE).

Vince.

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Same situation in my company. I decided to go my own way and bought personal licence (during discount), didn't even tried to "expense" it.
Speaking about (your) logic: I am an Eclipse switcher (I used eclipse starting with it's first public build). After switching back to Eclipse (few months ago) I just couldn't get used to it..it's not so about refactorings or other things I am missing, it's more about how it "feels". So, after I realised that:
a) I do programming for living and
b) for a few 100$ (no support package ;)) I could still happily use Idea,
I decided to pay for it by myself.
Eclipse is nice though, I wish you lot of happy coding with it...one day they'll maybe catchup with Idea ;)

Story goes like this:
There's an guy, named Mozart and he got invited for a party. Once he got there, he saw little boy playing piano. This boy played fabulous, he made no single mistake, and of course, he was playing Mozart's compositions. Once little boy finished with playing, Mozart came to him and said: "Uh boy, you can play fantastic!, but maybe one day, if you are really, really lucky, you could write something similar by yourself".

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Vincent O'Sullivan wrote:

Sadly, it's time for me to part with Idea. For the last two years I've got by at home, knocking out code for my personal use using Idea EAP releases.

This week I finally made the switch at work from a VB to a Java based project. Unfortunately, they use Eclipse and, not surprisingly, can't see the logic of paying hundreds of pounds for one developer to use a different IDE to everyone else (who are happily using a functionally almost identical free IDE).

Vince.


If your company cares about the money (which in fact is really a small
amount), you could tell them that you are more productive by using IDEA.
The initial cost is nothing compared to fast development afterwards with
a tool of choice. I dont say that its not possible with Eclipse, but i
for one felt very uncomfortable when using Eclipse the last time on
customer site and dropped it immediately, after convincing the project
leader that its better this way...

marc

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