Some intellij questions

Hi...

maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after some
months and found
1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the next
release?
2. Fabrique is a new product
is it possible to say something about it's functionality?

Last but not least I read something about Intellij acquired some CVS client
software (don't remember exactly, something with Magic... I think). Is this
going to be integrated with IDEA?

Ciao

...Jochen



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Hi,

I have read following on smartcvs.com
-- quote --

2003-06-23
IntelliJ IDEA used SmartCVS code
IntelliJ decided to use our CVS code for their award-winning Java-IDE
IntelliJ IDEA.

-- unquote --

Smartcvs is a great "easy to use" product. I really hope that the
information is correct.

Peter Lerche
http://easyspeedy.com

Jochen Riekhof wrote:

Hi...

maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after some
months and found
1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the next
release?
2. Fabrique is a new product
is it possible to say something about it's functionality?

Last but not least I read something about Intellij acquired some CVS
client software (don't remember exactly, something with Magic... I think).
Is this going to be integrated with IDEA?

Ciao

...Jochen


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Hi,

IntelliJ did not aquired (parts of) our code, because it is not possible
(90% are under SUNs Open License and therefore free). But I gave them
also the unopen CVS-related code from SmartCVS. How much they use, I
don't know exactly.

Cheers,
Thomas Singer (aka Tom)
_____________
smartcvs.com


Peter Lerche wrote:

Hi,

I have read following on smartcvs.com
-- quote --

2003-06-23
IntelliJ IDEA used SmartCVS code
IntelliJ decided to use our CVS code for their award-winning Java-IDE
IntelliJ IDEA.

-- unquote --

Smartcvs is a great "easy to use" product. I really hope that the
information is correct.

Peter Lerche
http://easyspeedy.com

Jochen Riekhof wrote:

>>Hi...
>>
>>maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after some
>>months and found
>>1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
>> so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the next
>>release?
>>2. Fabrique is a new product
>> is it possible to say something about it's functionality?
>>
>>Last but not least I read something about Intellij acquired some CVS
>>client software (don't remember exactly, something with Magic... I think).
>>Is this going to be integrated with IDEA?
>>
>>Ciao
>>
>>...Jochen




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> (90% are under SUNs Open License and therefore free).

It might sound a little bit incorrect. Hence here more details: only the
CVS core code is under SUNs Open License. SmartCVS implements a lot of
core interfaces - those implementations are closed source, but available
for IntelliJ.

Cheers,
Thomas Singer
_____________
smartcvs.com


Thomas Singer wrote:

Hi,

IntelliJ did not aquired (parts of) our code, because it is not possible
(90% are under SUNs Open License and therefore free). But I gave them
also the unopen CVS-related code from SmartCVS. How much they use, I
don't know exactly.

Cheers,
Thomas Singer (aka Tom)
_____________
smartcvs.com


Peter Lerche wrote:

>> Hi,
>>
>> I have read following on smartcvs.com
>> -- quote --
>>
>> 2003-06-23
>> IntelliJ IDEA used SmartCVS code
>> IntelliJ decided to use our CVS code for their award-winning Java-IDE
>> IntelliJ IDEA.
>>
>> -- unquote --
>>
>> Smartcvs is a great "easy to use" product. I really hope that the
>> information is correct.
>>
>> Peter Lerche
>> http://easyspeedy.com
>>
>> Jochen Riekhof wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Hi...
>>>
>>> maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after
>>> some
>>> months and found
>>> 1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
>>> so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the
>>> next
>>> release?
>>> 2. Fabrique is a new product
>>> is it possible to say something about it's functionality?
>>>
>>> Last but not least I read something about Intellij acquired some CVS
>>> client software (don't remember exactly, something with Magic... I
>>> think).
>>> Is this going to be integrated with IDEA?
>>>
>>> Ciao
>>>
>>> ...Jochen
>>
>>
>>



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In article <bitdmj$i03$1@is.intellij.net>,
"Jochen Riekhof" <jochen@riekhof.de> wrote:

Hi...

maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after some
months and found
1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the next
release?


I was under the impression that the used Visual Source Safe and then
switched to CVS. If they use Perforce, I would expect good Perforce
integration but there is none.

As it is, the only Perforce integration is through Richard Nemec's
PerforceDirectPlugin (see <http://www.intellij.org/> ).


Erik

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I was under the impression that the used Visual Source Safe and then
switched to CVS. If they use Perforce, I would expect good Perforce
integration but there is none.


Yes, we used Visual SourceSafe (and made and an intergration). Then we used
StarTeam for some time and got an integration as well. For Aurora we
switched to CVS just in order to make our CVS support good (AFAIK none in
the team like the CVS itself). Since Fabrique's (our new product being
developed) team switched to Perforce it's very likely we'll make an
integration in the next version.

--
Valentin Kipiatkov
JetBrains, Inc
http://www.intellij.com
"Develop with pleasure!"


"Erik Hanson" <ehanson-lists@eh.cdeh.org> wrote in message
news:ehanson-lists-779B84.15504402092003@host98.intellij.net...

In article <bitdmj$i03$1@is.intellij.net>,
"Jochen Riekhof" <jochen@riekhof.de> wrote:

Hi...

>

maybe a bit off-topic, but I scanned the intellij website today after

some

months and found
1. they claim to use Perforce as VCS
so, does it mean there a Perforce builtin support planned for the

next

release?

>

I was under the impression that the used Visual Source Safe and then
switched to CVS. If they use Perforce, I would expect good Perforce
integration but there is none.

>

As it is, the only Perforce integration is through Richard Nemec's
PerforceDirectPlugin (see <http://www.intellij.org/> ).

>
>

Erik



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What does your team not like about CVS and features drove them to choose Perforce? Just wondering as we are reviewing our SCM tools now.

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>Since Fabrique's (our new product being developed)

Can you tell something about what the Fabrique product is about...

Ciao

...Jochen



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There is lot of things which are not good about CVS. I can list some of them
which I can remember right now:

1. "CVS" subdirectories. At least, I see them when I look into the file
structure by a file browser. Obviously they contain some internal (to
version control system) and should not be exposed to the user.

2. No support for file renaming/moving.

3. No version control on directory level at all. For example, I cannot
remove a directory from the version control, only the files it contains.

4. Slow. For example, "update" command on our project takes a minute or two
(even if there were no changes at all). The version control should be
designed the way that the cost of any command depend on the amount of real
operations performed (e.g. file updating), not on the overall project size.

Don't know much about Perforce because its not used in IDEA project. I only
heard that it's better than CVS in all of the above respects.

--
Valentin Kipiatkov
JetBrains, Inc
http://www.intellij.com
"Develop with pleasure!"

"Peter Thistleton" <no_mail@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:5568126.1062881461434.JavaMail.itn@is.intellij.net...

What does your team not like about CVS and features drove them to choose

Perforce? Just wondering as we are reviewing our SCM tools now.


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it's great that you plan a own cvs-integration with all this great features for the next version. especialy point 2, 3 and 4 will be great improvements that i actually miss in the current cvs-integration!

THANKS for your great work!

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Michael, Valentin post didn't told us about what's missing in the current CVS integration -- he told us about what's missing in CVS itself. No integration or implementation of CVS would fix the problems he pointed out, unfortunately. For that, you need some other version control system, like Perforce, StarTeam or Subversion.

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oh sorry! my mistake!
no i know that my night was too short! ;)

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In article <bjk6rr$olj$1@is.intellij.net>,
"Valentin Kipiatkov \(JetBrains\)" <valentin@intellij.com> wrote:

There is lot of things which are not good about CVS. I can list some of them
which I can remember right now:

4. Slow. For example, "update" command on our project takes a minute or two
(even if there were no changes at all). The version control should be
designed the way that the cost of any command depend on the amount of real
operations performed (e.g. file updating), not on the overall project size.

Don't know much about Perforce because its not used in IDEA project. I only
heard that it's better than CVS in all of the above respects.


CVS' slowness is occasional (when you do "cvs update" or "cvs commit"),
but Perforce makes you wait every time you want to edit a file (in
addition to every time you want to update or commit).

For that reason, CVS feels faster to me than Perforce does.

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