30 comments

Wow, that looks neat. I would definitely use a feature like that.

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interesting, but I can't imagine this being productive ?!

"tom quas" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:8464456.1044873401522.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

Look at these guys:
http://www.iamethods.com/products/iam-developing/index.jsp

>

IMHO, this is going to be a big thing. Is JetBrains thinking about

incorporating such concepts in IDEA?
>
>

tom



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Perhaps as a creepy new look-over-the-shoulder tool for management?

Jon

Peter Sch?fer wrote:

interesting, but I can't imagine this being productive ?!

"tom quas" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:8464456.1044873401522.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

>>Look at these guys:
>>http://www.iamethods.com/products/iam-developing/index.jsp
>>
>>IMHO, this is going to be a big thing. Is JetBrains thinking about


incorporating such concepts in IDEA?

>>
>>tom



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I have been involved on projects where the collaboration between myself and another developer is very close, to the point sometimes of both of us sitting at one computer, with one person typing and the other helping. A feature like this would allow us each to remain at our desks, and with a keyboard, and could be very useful. A speakerphone would probably be needed for communication (or maybe the chat plugin for intellij?), but I for one would be interesting in trying out something like this. It would definitely take a shift in thinking, but I think it could prove to be useful.

0

A remote pair-programming tool... very useful.

"tom quas" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:8464456.1044873401522.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

Look at these guys:
http://www.iamethods.com/products/iam-developing/index.jsp

>

IMHO, this is going to be a big thing. Is JetBrains thinking about

incorporating such concepts in IDEA?
>
>

tom



0

Very cool, and to my mind has as much potential to change the way people develop as automated refactoring. Anything that would let people do code-reads, pair-programming and trouble-shooting sessions remotely would be all to the good, especially as geographically separated development teams become more and more common. This sort of thing also has the potential of adding a "network effect" to developer IDE choices. The more people that have this technology, the more useful it would be for any individual programmer to acquire it. IDEA is insanely great, and I prostelytize that fact, but the fact that I use doesn't encourage anyone else to use it. Add something like this, and it becomes possible to pitch IDEA at the organizational level, rather than the individual programmer level.

This all assumes that a JetBrains implementation of collaborative development would be as insanely great as all of their other feature development, and fit in seamlessly with the product's current feel. If someone feels like writing up a Tracker issue, I'll be happy to transfer a big bunch of votes (or else I'll probably get around to it tomorrow).

0

As someone who is managing a group of developers I'd find this useful. I spend much of my day either looking over someone's sholder helping them with their issues or having them look over my sholder while I explain how something works.

My problem would be that rest of the group prefers working in emacs, vi or JBuilder while I like idea. ]]>


geoff

0

"tom quas" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:8464456.1044873401522.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

Look at these guys:
http://www.iamethods.com/products/iam-developing/index.jsp

>

IMHO, this is going to be a big thing. Is JetBrains thinking about

incorporating such concepts in IDEA?

It's definitely a cool thing, but I doubt it will be much of use
for the most of IDEA customers. I'd prefer to see IDEA simple
and slim rather then polluted with rarely used cool features
(JBuilder is a perfect example).

While pair programming is presented as a fun thing to do,
fathers-founders always stressed that test first, refactoring,
programming to requirements and short release cycles and
continous integration are way important.

IMHO supplying build-in interfaces to bug-tracking, requirements
management systems (like bugzilla or clarify), and continious
integration platforms (or such a CI platform itself, there are no
many of them out there) would be much more useful as it would
cover major XP points.

Looking at the website above the only thing I can say that guys are tring
to build a general purpose IDE making this collaborative development
a buying point. Don't think it's a good idea. We've already got one :)

Regards,

Slava Imeshev


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My problem would be that rest of the group prefers working in emacs, vi or

JBuilder while I like idea. ]]>

How weird?! Our 12 people team was convinced after about 4 weeks, and now
all our JBuilder licenses are almost unused.

My deepest sympathy

Ciao

...Jochen




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You can forget about intellij being simple and slim. They announced a gui builder for the 4.0 version, in a magazine of all places

0

I'd give them more credit than that.

IntelliJ isn't simple and slim right now - in fact by a very long way it's
the largest Java app I run. What it has going for it is an abundance of
features that are there when I need them and don't get in my way when I
don't. I have a lot of confidence that if we see a GUI builder in the next
version that it'll be just as well thought out.

Guy

"charles decroes" <spam@decroes.com> wrote in message
news:9392571.1044988569319.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

You can forget about intellij being simple and slim. They announced a gui

builder for the 4.0 version, in a magazine of all places


0

I haven't seen anyone else mention this, so here goes:

What's wrong with just using VNC for this? Then it doesn't matter what
IDE your co-workers use, they can see what you're doing, and you can see
what they're doing from anywhere -- barring firewall issues. ;)

Find out more at:
http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/
or
http://www.tightvnc.com/


~Mike

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I have used VNC for remote pairing. I works well as long as you have high
bandwidth connection and you limit your desktop to XGA or at most SXGA. You
still have to deal with latency and the fact that you do not have physical
mouse or keyboard to make clear who is driving. You have to train yourself
to do what you would do when talking into a talkie-walkie: "I am taking over
now", "ok you can go ahead". Otherwise prepare yourself for some frustration
while typing somewhere you do not want as your partner has moved and click
the mouse;-)

Jacques
"Mike Abney" <michaelno.abneyspam@retek-nospam-.com> wrote in message
news:Xns931F8F3AB5EB0michaelabney1990@213.182.181.98...

I haven't seen anyone else mention this, so here goes:

>

What's wrong with just using VNC for this? Then it doesn't matter what
IDE your co-workers use, they can see what you're doing, and you can see
what they're doing from anywhere -- barring firewall issues. ;)

>

Find out more at:
http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/
or
http://www.tightvnc.com/

>
>

~Mike



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I totally agrre with what you say, Dave. Right now I'm involved in a project with development groups located in the U.S., England, and Germany. There are often situations where I wished I could support people on the other end online. I can see the need for such tools. I also agree that a paradigm shift is necessary. It took us a long time to accept that refactorings and constant change are an integral part of projectswell, some of us still haven'tand those who accept this need to be open to new ways.

It's interesting to follow the discussion and how people are afraid that "somebody looks over their shoulders." The only question that comes to my mind when I hear this: is your code actually so bad that you can't show it to your peers? Peace, brothers ;)

Concerning the code bloat: I wished IDEA would bundle such add-ons in optional modules that do not affect the overall functionality. The programmer should decide which modules she wants to install to extend the IDE.

0

Well said.

Then I want 'simple and slim' I'll use Notepad. Idea give me comprehensive and fully featured support.

Vince.

0

"Vincent O'Sullivan" <vjosullivan@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:29094690.1045049339371.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

Well said.

>

Then I want 'simple and slim' I'll use Notepad. Idea give me

comprehensive and fully featured support.

Notepas isn't simple and slim. It's dumb :)

Regards,

Slava Imeshev


0

"Andrew Cowling" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
news:32241823.1045086911318.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...

When I want 'simple and slim' I'll use ed.
http://www.sbernard.ee/ed.html


Looks like I hit the right spot with 'simple and slim' :))

Regards,

Slava Imeshev


0

This is available in Windows XP and is called Remote Assistance. The only
drawback
is that you both need XP :)

On Mon, 10 Feb 2003 10:29:51 -0500, Jon Steelman <steelman@mindspring.com>
wrote:

Perhaps as a creepy new look-over-the-shoulder tool for management?

>

Jon

>

Peter Sch?fer wrote:

>> interesting, but I can't imagine this being productive ?!
>>
>> "tom quas" <jiveadmin@jetbrains.com> wrote in message
>> news:8464456.1044873401522.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net...
>>
>>> Look at these guys:
>>> http://www.iamethods.com/products/iam-developing/index.jsp
>>>
>>> IMHO, this is going to be a big thing. Is JetBrains thinking about
>>
>> incorporating such concepts in IDEA?
>>
>>>
>>> tom

--

- Rene Smit

0

At last, this seems to become a trend which might decide who's gonna stay in the competition. Hey, they have eXtreme Programming in their marketing blurb ;)

I'd really love to hear a statement of the JetBrains concerning this matter.

http://hydra.globalse.org/

0

In article <26460711.1049695890176.JavaMail.jrun@is.intellij.net>,
jiveadmin@jetbrains.com says...

At last, this seems to become a trend which might decide who's gonna stay in the competition. Hey, they have eXtreme Programming in their marketing blurb ;)

I'd really love to hear a statement of the JetBrains concerning this matter.

http://hydra.globalse.org/


From their website:

"Wouldn't it be great to edit the same document, live, in realtime,
together with everyone in your group?"

Maybe I'm just naive, but it sounds like a potential nightmare!

:)

0

From all I've heard until now in this forum thread,
it seems to me that XP (eXtreme Programing) (or lightweight software methodologies, to a certain extent) is far from being the favorite development process among the developer community !! ;)

Open your minds guys, collaborative processes are great, they just require more courage and discipline.

http://www.extremeprogramming.org
http://www.xprogramming.com
http://www.jera.com/techinfo/xpfaq.html
http://linux.oreillynet.com/pub/a/linux/2001/05/04/xp_intro.html

"Extreme Programming is a discipline of software development based on values of simplicity, communication, feedback, and courage. It works by bringing the whole team together in the presence of simple practices, with enough feedback to enable the team to see where they are and to tune the practices to their unique situation."

Dan/

0

I'd love it if they enabled something like this in intellij (with an off switch, of course ;o) There's a zeroconf/rendezvous java library here:

http://www.strangeberry.com/java_rendevous.htm

I think integrating rendezvous into the app would lead to lots of interesting uses...

maybe we should file a feature request.

--pete

0

Peter Morelli wrote:

I'd love it if they enabled something like this in intellij (with an off switch, of course ;o) There's a zeroconf/rendezvous java library here:

http://www.strangeberry.com/java_rendevous.htm

I think integrating rendezvous into the app would lead to lots of interesting uses...

maybe we should file a feature request.


Do you really want a feature where all the connected sessions freeze in
unison when any one of the IDEA sessions performs garbage collection? ;)

Jon

0

"Wouldn't it be great to edit the same document, live, in realtime,
together with everyone in your group?"


You can already do that (if you are on a Mac):

http://hydra.globalse.org/

I know that this is far from IDEA but if you have more than one Mac on
the network, you might want to give it a try. Just to give you an
impression what it feels like to work on the same piece of code with
several people.

I wish that I had more than one Mac on my network so that I could try it
myself.

Best regards,

Dirk Dittert

0

Dirk Dittert <dittert@despammed.com> wrote:



can somebody please make sure that I stop using my computer for today?
Especially that I stop writing to newsgroups...

Dirk

0

On Tue, 08 Apr 2003 23:07:24 -0400, Dirk Dittert wrote:

can somebody please make sure that I stop using my computer for today?
Especially that I stop writing to newsgroups...


I've always wondered - if we abolished developer mailing lists, and
newsgroups, would our productivity increase?

And if so - are we actually doing ANY code at the moment? ;0

0

Mark Derricutt <pinhead@satinism.org> wrote:

And if so - are we actually doing ANY code at the moment? ;0


I am studying my code very carefully right now. That is, I look at it
all the time -- and then decide to do something else ;)

Dirk

0

On Wed, 09 Apr 2003 11:48:55 -0400, Dirk Dittert wrote:

>> And if so - are we actually doing ANY code at the moment? ;0


I am studying my code very carefully right now. That is, I look at it all
the time -- and then decide to do something else ;)


Heh - I know the feeling. When we do our morning catchup meetings I'm
always tempted to add in "oh, and about an hour just blankly staring at
the screen", but I dont think it'd go down well with the boss.

0

xyz processes are great, they just require...
Dan


Do you just hate it when there's a caveat tacked on the end!

Vince.



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