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Moreover, I think the famous "two months" period has ended !
So it should be the time to start the new EAP

Guillaume


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I can't wait much longer. Please give us new food for discussion. :)

Tom

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I did a search of open issues and there is 6.5 pages worth of bugs/features/requests planned for the next release. Of these lots of them are still not marked as fixed. All of that being said, I don't expect us to see an eap for a while.

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Charles, do not expect all rfe's being implemented when EAP starts.
EAP is not a beta-phase, it's a process.

When the Ariadna-EAP began 12 months ago, IntelliJ presented us a
road-map of the planned features and started to implement them
step-by-step. And exactly this participation on the whole project's
development is, what makes the IntelliJ EAP so powerful and valueable
(for both sides).

Tom

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BTW, as I already said, I want to emphasize, that I'm sure, a lot of
the existing customers would like to see rather a 6 month release
cycle instead of the previous 12 month release cycle.

So, JetBrains, please build a smaller version 3.5 before a large
version 4.

Best regards,
Tom

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"Thomas Singer" <idea@regnis.de> wrote in message
news:b0oc2v8sjo14di0kon4fiqcv4j97logier@4ax.com...

BTW, as I already said, I want to emphasize, that I'm sure, a lot of
the existing customers would like to see rather a 6 month release
cycle instead of the previous 12 month release cycle.

>

So, JetBrains, please build a smaller version 3.5 before a large
version 4.


A 6 month release cycle means that we would have to pay for upgrades more
often. (If 3.5 is considered a "minor" version upgrade then those who
shelled out the extra bucks for the annual support contract will get it for
free, but those of us who didn't would have to convince our bosses to pay
again.)

So my vote would be for a 2 year EAP, where every build is bug-free and has
all the features I want :)


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Remember that you would only pay for the new features. 1/2 new features =
1/2 upgrade price. So at the end of the year we should have paid sensibly
the same amount given that we would have 1/2 of the features "release ready"
twice as fast. Let's not forget that even if we pay full price for the first
one, the 8 months free upgrade policy would cover the second 1/2 release
anyway. In any case the only problem would be to have to justify twice an
upgrade. Even in my big organization we could still plan for it upfront and
pay it in 2 installments.
In any case, as we have seen with Ariadna, towards the end of the EAP, IDEA
was getting really heavy (poor performance and a lot of bugs). 10 months EAP
is enough I think. Longer and towards the end I would not upgrade as often
as I did which is not what JetBrains want.
Sometimes back, a middle ground approach was proposed where we would get a
"release" quality EAP build every 1-2 months. So every 2 months or so
JetBrains would spend 2 weeks to close bugs and optimize as much as
possible. I believe that would make the overall EAP experience a lot
smoother. Question is: how much slower would new features be introduced?
However I always prefer quality over quantity.

Jacques

"Erik Hanson" <ehanson@comsys.com> wrote in message
news:b06j2j$crh$1@is.intellij.net...

"Thomas Singer" <idea@regnis.de> wrote in message
news:b0oc2v8sjo14di0kon4fiqcv4j97logier@4ax.com...

BTW, as I already said, I want to emphasize, that I'm sure, a lot of
the existing customers would like to see rather a 6 month release
cycle instead of the previous 12 month release cycle.

>

So, JetBrains, please build a smaller version 3.5 before a large
version 4.

>

A 6 month release cycle means that we would have to pay for upgrades more
often. (If 3.5 is considered a "minor" version upgrade then those who
shelled out the extra bucks for the annual support contract will get it

for

free, but those of us who didn't would have to convince our bosses to pay
again.)

>

So my vote would be for a 2 year EAP, where every build is bug-free and

has

all the features I want :)

>
>


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quality is much more important than quantity!
but if JetBrains tell us the new eap will start in 2 month they should start the new eap in 2 month. if they don't know when the last Adriana build is finished the should say whe don't know when the new eap start.

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Folks on here are pretty funny. They give you one little answer and you DEMAND that they start when they say they start. Try that on Oracle, IBM, Apple, Microsoft, Rational, Borland... hahahaha... this is too funny. It's not YOUR company folks, and just because you paid for the software doesn't give you the right to whine about the next EAP or anything except for the software quality. Paying for the software entitles you to using the software according to the license, and the license doesn't have anything in it which says, you may harrass us about how we run our company. Why does everyone want the next EAP so bad? Is the current version not enough for you, or is it that you don't have a license and you want to run IDEA for free again? Gosh man, let's get off this boat and get onto more important and useful discussions! ]]>

R

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excuse me, but there is no idea intellij icon beside your name that shows
you are a part of intellij software group. I am wondering how you can use
"we" as if you were talking on behalf of the intellij group when using this
harsh language.


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I believe that Robert was talking in the context of the license when he said
we, it probably would have been clearer if written in the form:

'... the license doesn't have anything in it which says "you may harrass us
about how we run our company".'

I do agree with Robert to some extent; I feel that holding the JetBrains
guys up to 'promises' that they have made on these groups is only going to
put into jeopardy the currently open relationship that we as an eap team
have with them. You can bet that a few more complaints about 'broken
promises' and they'll think very carefully about announcing anything early
to us at all, Maybe the threat of this prompts Robert to use 'harsh words'.

IMHO its better having insider hints about what the future plans are (which
at the end of the day is all their comments on this group mount up to) than
no info at all.

N.


anton modaresi wrote:

excuse me, but there is no idea intellij icon beside your name that
shows you are a part of intellij software group. I am wondering how
you can use "we" as if you were talking on behalf of the intellij
group when using this harsh language.



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"Nathan Brown" <nedski@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b09dds$h9j$1@is.intellij.net...
>

I do agree with Robert to some extent; I feel that holding the JetBrains
guys up to 'promises' that they have made on these groups is only going to
put into jeopardy the currently open relationship that we as an eap team
have with them. You can bet that a few more complaints about 'broken
promises' and they'll think very carefully about announcing anything early
to us at all,


Very well put.

Formal announcements are for press releases and things like that.


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On Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:08:37 +0000, Nathan Brown wrote:


I do agree with Robert to some extent; I feel that holding the JetBrains
guys up to 'promises' that they have made on these groups is only going to
put into jeopardy the currently open relationship that we as an eap team


I think we're lucky that Jetbrains actually run any form of EAP at all -
it was the EAP and progress and visibility of them fixing things which
leant me towards justifying the cost of registration.

I can't imagine Borland doing an EAP on JBuilder...

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First of all, this sounds ridiculous that people over here are demanding for
a EAP program right now. First of all IDEA 3.0 isn't that stable. Look at
the amount of open bugs in the database that are not allocated to Arrora.
And these bugs have been reported by u all. Don't u want these bugs to be
fixed. There are around 500 of them. So suppose they start EAP tommorrow,
which means adding new features and fixing bugs allocated for Arrora, when
will they fix these 500 flotting bugs??
Or is it that u don't care about these 500 flotting bugs, and u want to jump
in to see new features. Don't be selfish, think for others, not just for
yourself !!!!


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Hi Nathan,

Well, maybe I was hasty pass judgement, maybe he didn't mean to impersonate
intellij and forgot the quotas just being upset. I wish people wouldnt act
in anger and would take time to think and calm down a bit at least when
writing in forums. It's much nicer with a friendly environment. Anyways my
apologies for me being hasty. I agree with you too. the more info the
better...


"Nathan Brown" <nedski@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b09dds$h9j$1@is.intellij.net...

I believe that Robert was talking in the context of the license when he

said

we, it probably would have been clearer if written in the form:

>

'... the license doesn't have anything in it which says "you may harrass

us

about how we run our company".'

>

I do agree with Robert to some extent; I feel that holding the JetBrains
guys up to 'promises' that they have made on these groups is only going to
put into jeopardy the currently open relationship that we as an eap team
have with them. You can bet that a few more complaints about 'broken
promises' and they'll think very carefully about announcing anything early
to us at all, Maybe the threat of this prompts Robert to use 'harsh

words'.
>

IMHO its better having insider hints about what the future plans are

(which

at the end of the day is all their comments on this group mount up to)

than

no info at all.

>

N.

>
>

anton modaresi wrote:

excuse me, but there is no idea intellij icon beside your name that
shows you are a part of intellij software group. I am wondering how
you can use "we" as if you were talking on behalf of the intellij
group when using this harsh language.

>
>


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We have implemented long planned major architectural changes in IDEA and now
our development team is switching to Aurora as IDE. As soon as it gets a bit
more stable we'll start the new EAP (in 2 weeks?).

--
Valentin Kipiatkov
JetBrains, Inc
http://www.intellij.com
"Develop with pleasure!"

"Thomas Singer" <idea@regnis.de> wrote in message
news:reua2v4ranbqhjc26arci1ns88mf548o00@4ax.com...
>


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Valentin Kipiatkov wrote:

We have implemented long planned major architectural changes in IDEA and now
our development team is switching to Aurora as IDE. As soon as it gets a bit
more stable we'll start the new EAP (in 2 weeks?).


That's great news! Can you now share with us what major feature set
IntelliJ has in mind for Aurora? And how long is Aurora development
expected to take?

Thanks,
Jon

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Awsome!

I can't wait!

Amnon

"Valentin Kipiatkov" <valentin@intellij.com> wrote in message
news:b0hhsr$cuh$1@is.intellij.net...

We have implemented long planned major architectural changes in IDEA and

now

our development team is switching to Aurora as IDE. As soon as it gets a

bit

more stable we'll start the new EAP (in 2 weeks?).

>

--
Valentin Kipiatkov
JetBrains, Inc
http://www.intellij.com
"Develop with pleasure!"

>

"Thomas Singer" <idea@regnis.de> wrote in message
news:reua2v4ranbqhjc26arci1ns88mf548o00@4ax.com...
>

>
>


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On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 22:15:38 +0300, Valentin Kipiatkov wrote:

We have implemented long planned major architectural changes in IDEA and


Hopefully that won't mean plugin compatability issues?

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Hi Valentin,

These are good news. Refactoring (== architectural changes) are almost
a good thing before implementing any new feature.

Is there already a (maybe short) list about what is planned for
Aurora?

Tom

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saumendra wrote:

First of all, this sounds ridiculous that people over here are demanding for
a EAP program right now. First of all IDEA 3.0 isn't that stable.


Hmm. I, and my team, use idea all day every day. The only problem I
consistently run into is the lack of multiple concurrent debug sessions.
And that is not a bug but rather a limitation on the current design.

So I wonder, even though there are 500 bugs in the database, how many of
those 500 regulary effect day-to-day use? (I'm not saying they dont';
I'm asking if they do.)

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Hi.

You can use the Tracker to see what issues are planned to be a part of Aurora.

To do this you go to the Tracker, select the "IDEA >> Requests" link and then select the "Search" link.

In the search you should specify the following:
Based on: "All"

In the first combo box that should say "]]>" you need to select "Planned for version" and as you do that, two other combo boxes appear. The next one says "Equals" and you should keep that but in the third combo box (the last one) select the version that you're interested in (in your case Aurora). Don't specify any other fields and press the "Search" button.

You should get a list of all issues that have been registered and are scheduled for resolving in Aurora. Note that these issues can be of any type, that means that they could be bug fixes or feature enhancements. You can, if you want to, specify what type of issue you want to see in the search phase (create another filter where you have "Type EQUALS Feature").

Regards, Stefan.

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That's nice to hear.

I'd like to ask you a few questions more:

1) Do you know if Aurora will be a minor or a major version?
2) In case of a minor version how long is the release cycle (again, only if you know). Would the release fall into the 4 month limit on the basic licence agreement? (I probably don't need to tell you that we're on a very limited budget and I only managed to squeeze out the money to buy an IDE in general...).

Kind regards, and thanks once again for an excellent tool.

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i think it's a mijor version beacause the new number ist 4.0!!!

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>... beacause the new number ist 4.0!!!

Who told this?

Tom

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Look at the author.

--
Best regards,
Mike Aizatsky.
-


JetBrains, Inc / IntelliJ Software
http://www.intellij.com
"Develop with pleasure!"


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sorry, was my mistake!

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